157. [FEISTY WIFE EPISODE] Stop Wanting Your Partner To Be More Like You w/ Silvy Khoucasian LMFT

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[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to Bridging Connections, formerly known as men this way.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host, Brian, with a wide reaves.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Former U.S.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Air Force Captain turned author and professional coach to men, women, and couples.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Alongside me as co-host, my lifelong friend of over forty years to air.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Here we have the raw, real conversations we need to be having about the topics that matter most, relationships, purpose, health, spirituality, and more.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Please subscribe to stay connected.

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[SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's dive.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So, how do you want to start this episode?

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[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to start off by acknowledging that the host of the podcast is late.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Halley?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And who the host of the podcast be me?

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[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well.

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[SPEAKER_02]: What time is it?

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[SPEAKER_00]: It is three, forty seven.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Who is supposed to start?

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[SPEAKER_02]: Seventy minutes ago.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Time is ticking.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's true.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But in my defense, you did want to take me outside and play with me.

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[SPEAKER_02]: We had to play with our dog.

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[SPEAKER_02]: We had to take care of her.

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[SPEAKER_00]: See, and this is to highlight the subject of today's podcast, which is, which is embrace differences.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think there's so much a different size issue, more of a respect issue.

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[SPEAKER_02]: That's the right.

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[SPEAKER_02]: It is.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Respect.

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[SPEAKER_02]: She says.

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[SPEAKER_02]: That's an av my boss babe.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I guess I took that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Name tag.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Your boss babe, name tag on?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Looks cute.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I like it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, embrace differences.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think this is, are we, is this it?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Are we in?

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[SPEAKER_02]: This is it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

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[SPEAKER_02]: My time is valuable.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I like this Sylvie.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So welcome to Bridging Connections podcast.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host Brian Reeves with Brian with my Reeves.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And today I have on my lovely and feisty wife, Sylvie Kucasian.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Say hi to everybody, Sylvie.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Hello.

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[SPEAKER_02]: It's Holgasian, but I'll let that one slide as well today.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, you are in a mode.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You are in a mode and a mood.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm about, you know, since this is the third episode that I'm a guest on that I could finally fully unmask and be me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I invite it.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And I welcome and pray that your listeners are ready for it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I pray that they're for it as well.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I hope that the levels

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[SPEAKER_00]: I hope that the levels are okay, that our voices are coming in equally strong.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're just, you record this way.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah, we'll figure it out.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We'll make it work.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So, embrace differences.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're thinking about what to talk about in this episode.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're thinking about our, we did a keynote talk together in Vancouver a few months ago.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The real love ready in bloom conference.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's a world-class relationship conference.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We were, you were not together.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think there were what eight speakers total.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You and me and the governments were speaking and Dr. Sarah.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Nazar Zade, I'll see you on the side there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, beautiful last name.

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[SPEAKER_02]: The Mona Hoffman.

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[SPEAKER_00]: to Mona Hoffman, Shimira Howard, Dr. Shimira Shimira Howard.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Who else was speaking?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Who else spoke?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm blanking.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Sean Gallonos was hosting that might have been it, actually.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There weren't a lot of speakers.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think that was it, babe.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I think that might have happened.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Then you and me, we're the other two speakers.

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[SPEAKER_02]: That was it.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So it was a great, great, great, great honor for us.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We got to open that conference.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And we talked about are the subject of our keynote speech together was embracing differences.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Would you say that you and me are different?

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[SPEAKER_02]: I would say that we are, we are very different in our personalities and very similar in our values.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that's a nice, that's an interesting way to put it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, different in our personalities.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But similar in our values, I think there's that's very true.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And similar in our relationship vision, I think we want the same thing out of relation to our ethics.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Relationship ethics, the things we stand for, the things that are important to us, the ways of relating.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And I think we have very complimentary relational strengths.

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[SPEAKER_02]: We're very different in our strengths.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And I think they are very complimentary.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And the things we love about one another might also be the things that drive us nuts.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure many of you relate to that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that also, you know, in the personality differences with some of the things that also show up are like, you know,

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like when we travel.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Who's on time and who's not on time?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think we're both on time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I just think one of us is more comfortable with not being flexible about not being on time.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Or your version of three, thirty might also be three, thirty, two.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Or three, forty, seven.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But when communicated, of course, I mean, because that we both value respect, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And time is about honoring time, honoring appointments, meetings is about respect.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The thing is that one of our differences, like I believe that respect can be maintained even when you're late.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I did a, I was on a, I was doing a training on the trauma of money that this wonderful teacher Shantel had a guest that spoke about money and time.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And he did this exercise where

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[SPEAKER_02]: He basically had his guess when we hit the one minute mark, and I was the first one on time, right on time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You mean, there was just silence.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone be quiet.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to wait till, like, when you think a minute goes by, raise your hand.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, and I was right there.

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[SPEAKER_02]: My precision, but it also, you know, it comes from a sense of like rigidity.

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[SPEAKER_02]: It can be held in almost like a rigid way where there's like a flexibility that

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[SPEAKER_02]: can also serve me in some context obviously being, you know, late for clients, that's not going to happen.

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[SPEAKER_02]: But in other ways, I've, well, breathe.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Who would have was the, what's the fear there behind being a little bit late, even if it's communicated like, what's going to happen?

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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to be in trouble.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Were you counting during that minute or were you just feeling it?

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[SPEAKER_02]: I have a pretty intuitive sense of time because of my, doing therapy and coaching sessions.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm also very musically sensitive.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Like I've always been really good with, you know, just the beats and the sounds of music.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And I just think it's something I'm very hyper aware of, really good at it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's interesting because as I think of it, I'm a drummer.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So time is essential, vital, timing, time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And though I have to count it in my head, and if I'm not counting it, then it's easy for me to lose track.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Got it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas I wonder if you feel more intuitive.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The passage of time.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And then we're... So, and I also work out, so I'm always timing things when I'm taking breaks and rest, so like, I've just kind of, I don't know, I'm a very hyper-attuned to it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I think this is interesting as we're talking about embracing differences because one of the great conflicts that can happen in a couple.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't even think people really think about it is time and timing, pacing, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Even pacing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I remember one of our first big trips, right, to Ireland.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to talk you on a five week tour of the entire island of Ireland.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I thought it was the best thing

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[SPEAKER_00]: in the world that we could have possibly done five weeks just driving around seeing the entirety of Ireland.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Had a personal true guide y'all.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And how was that experience for you?

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[SPEAKER_02]: Well, what's interesting in the relationship to the time conversation is that when I'm not working, when I'm not in my work mode, I like to be checked out of time.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And so I like to move, especially when I'm traveling, I like to have a lot of spaciousness.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I like to drop into a particular place and really ground in.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I like when the same coffee shop, I like to be in the same place for a week, whereas for you, I know you need more variety and stimulation.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And you want to see as much as you can while we're there.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I want to go.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I want to fill up the space with my brain is insatiably curious.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I want to see all that there is to see and smell all the smells and the sights and and and and again, I think that relates in many ways too time in our

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[SPEAKER_00]: our experience of time, because I'm like, I'm wheeling out five weeks.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We gotta go.

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[SPEAKER_02]: That's true.

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[SPEAKER_02]: You were also, I think, you had a faster pace when we started our relationship.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I think you were ready to move forward and meeting family, and I think I needed a lot more.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I need a lot more time, and I'm a slower processor.

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[SPEAKER_02]: It's one of our other differences.

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[SPEAKER_02]: It takes me longer to digest and release, swallow and experience.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's right, yeah.

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[SPEAKER_02]: And you're like lightning speed processor.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, exactly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: My brain's like, done.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Got it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's assimilated in my thoughts.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

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[SPEAKER_00]: What's the next?

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[SPEAKER_00]: What do we onto the next?

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's true.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's one of our early, I wouldn't say struggles, but one of the sort of, one of the differences that we ran into, that again, I don't think we had to necessarily knew what was going on as much or had the language for it, but it was.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I was ready to just throw you into my life.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Get on my magic carpet ride.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're going.

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[SPEAKER_02]: It's like, well, then I need to know the size of the carpet.

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[SPEAKER_02]: What color is it?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wait a second.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Slow down.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that I think one of the challenges when we talk about differences, most, you know, I've said this a lot to couples over the years, because I figured this out early in coaching, working with couples, really, is that

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's not the differences between us that causes problems.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's constantly making those differences.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're trying to make those difference go away.

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[SPEAKER_02]: They're making them wrong.

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[SPEAKER_02]: They're making them wrong, judging them.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly, making them wrong.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I think back to our early days, there were some differences that we were

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, when you run into a difference, it hurts.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It can hurt.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's confusing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It can be scary.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It can be like, whoa, whoa, why don't you want what I want?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And it can cause all kinds of doubts and all kinds of stuff can come up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I've got so normal, but yeah.

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[SPEAKER_02]: So I thought it would be interesting to highlight some gaps that couples can experience that I think comes up a lot in my coaching work with individuals.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Let's just name some of those things.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Do you have that list of right here?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I do have that list, and we're so glad.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's see, this is from when we did our.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to just name off of couple.

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[SPEAKER_02]: So cultural gaps, you know, Brian and I were very, very different cultural context.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm Armenian, born in Saudi Arabia.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Family was raised in Syria, so I have a lot of Armenian and Arabic influence.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Brian, you're, I think, background is.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm about as white as it gets.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm about white, white American, although when we met, I was very proud of my Puerto Rican heritage, which I learned wasn't really Puerto Rican.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was just Spanish, European Spanish.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, Irish, you know, just Western European but basically.

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[SPEAKER_02]: So cultural, obviously religious differences.

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[SPEAKER_02]: I come from a culture that also is very communal, which is very much about the Wii.

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[SPEAKER_02]: The buying comes from a culture that is, you know, for more American roots, that is much more individualistic.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Self, you know, that individual self oriented.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And yep, the greater culture, but also just family culture.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, my family was very much, you know, every man for himself, every man.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I left home basically when I was sixteen to go to college, get on a scholarship that I got myself.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And I was just, I didn't get a lot of support from my family from that time on.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Not certainly not financial support.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So I was starting to take care of myself at a very young age.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And whereas you, man, the support that your family, the way that you all

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[SPEAKER_00]: Support each other is like so foreign to my, to my experience.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And it's beautiful.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously, you know, independence is beautiful.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That support is beautiful.

13:00.749 --> 13:02.370
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's shadows on both sides.

13:02.390 --> 13:03.351
[SPEAKER_04]: Right?

13:03.371 --> 13:08.075
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we've talked about this a big reason you and I chose each other kind of intuitively instinctively.

13:08.175 --> 13:12.679
[SPEAKER_00]: Like on a, there was like, there's like each of us had something for the other.

13:13.961 --> 13:25.441
[SPEAKER_00]: right you had you had a home you feel like home you were like you know there was a like the enmeshment of the communal system is like on some level of starving for right whereas I know

13:25.909 --> 13:42.241
[SPEAKER_02]: I was starving for adventure and to kind of land on my own two feet and really launch in that kind of more self-oriented way, still within the family system, but kind of feel that courage to take off and really take these bigger risks in my life.

13:42.521 --> 13:47.125
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, in another gap in relationships is age gap.

13:47.185 --> 13:48.346
[SPEAKER_02]: I think this is a really big one.

13:48.426 --> 13:51.628
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, you and I have a almost nine year gap, almost decades.

13:51.648 --> 13:54.430
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a little over nine years, I think.

13:54.450 --> 13:54.931
[SPEAKER_02]: That's, you know,

13:56.052 --> 14:18.612
[SPEAKER_02]: years in itself don't necessarily mean much but the different developmental stages that a person is in will impact what the priority is for them in that current stage and you could be in a particular developmental stage and your partner might be in a very different one so again it doesn't mean in its bad it's wrong it's just that we often try to

14:20.334 --> 14:25.739
[SPEAKER_02]: pull the person into the places that we are so we can maintain and create connection and symmetry.

14:27.241 --> 14:29.523
[SPEAKER_02]: So what are some other differences?

14:29.583 --> 14:31.845
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it would be helpful to name a few more.

14:31.985 --> 14:36.310
[SPEAKER_00]: So other differences intimacy, affection, sexual needs or desires.

14:37.352 --> 14:49.039
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, run into that all the time where one partner has a different, you know, you and I've over the years, we've looked at study and it's been helpful for us.

14:49.159 --> 14:52.761
[SPEAKER_00]: The section of the erotic blueprints are created by a woman named Jaya.

14:54.325 --> 14:55.487
[SPEAKER_00]: the fiberotic blueprints.

14:56.749 --> 15:00.214
[SPEAKER_00]: But also, which we're not going to go into those here, that's not that important right now.

15:00.694 --> 15:06.162
[SPEAKER_00]: But people have different on ramps to sexual turn on.

15:06.723 --> 15:10.068
[SPEAKER_00]: They need different things to be in place, to be happening.

15:12.674 --> 15:18.676
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, one partner might really enjoy public displays of affection whereas the other might feel really uncomfortable about it.

15:19.057 --> 15:19.757
[SPEAKER_00]: Why are you looking at me?

15:20.777 --> 15:21.818
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a smiling.

15:23.418 --> 15:25.519
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm the golden retriever in this relationship, so.

15:25.679 --> 15:27.400
[SPEAKER_00]: She probably knows my face in public.

15:27.420 --> 15:27.860
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't mind.

15:27.880 --> 15:31.681
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, she'll lick my face in public and I'd act a little uncomfortable as that.

15:31.721 --> 15:33.962
[SPEAKER_00]: That's not unsure.

15:34.242 --> 15:37.964
[SPEAKER_00]: And as well pacing coming back to time again, pacing.

15:39.485 --> 16:07.701
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... both at the beginning of the relationship but but also at the beginning at just the beginning of a sexual encounter right pacing time one partner it's just it's just how it works that one partner they're gonna have different places you know and and maybe you have the same pace at the beginning but over time is the relationship evolves in the church all of a sudden one of you just realizes i need actually need more time to get turned on things like that what else we got

16:09.463 --> 16:29.518
[SPEAKER_02]: privacy versus what what a couple hold as private can look different on each end of a spectrum and really clarifying what the boundaries are what's sacred what's not going to be discussed or maybe collaboratively figuring out all right who are the people we're going to go to when we are in relationship crisis because I do think that's important and that is

16:31.538 --> 16:46.641
[SPEAKER_02]: It is essential to figure that out, whether it's a therapist, counselor, or maybe you guys have really trusted friends in your community, but not really airing all your challenging moments to just anybody.

16:46.661 --> 16:55.123
[SPEAKER_02]: That can be really, really harmful to the relationship and what you will be vocal about, what you won't be vocal about, privacy matters.

16:55.443 --> 16:57.024
[SPEAKER_00]: Especially in the day of social media.

16:57.424 --> 16:58.024
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god.

16:58.464 --> 17:00.365
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a it's a thing like it never was before.

17:00.665 --> 17:01.226
[SPEAKER_01]: That's true.

17:01.626 --> 17:01.746
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

17:01.766 --> 17:17.113
[SPEAKER_00]: What are you going to share on social media where you're going to talk about what's I think especially as a couple you know you and I had that challenge at the beginning because I was I was at I'm my work was being an open book back in two thousand the early you know two thousand eleven twelve thirteen fourteen fifty and then

17:18.018 --> 17:21.820
[SPEAKER_00]: When you came along, I just thought, well, I'm just going to keep doing what I always do.

17:22.360 --> 17:25.721
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're like, uh, this isn't comfortable for me.

17:25.741 --> 17:26.842
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, what do you mean?

17:27.102 --> 17:27.882
[SPEAKER_00]: This is my story.

17:27.902 --> 17:29.163
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, well, I mean, you're story now.

17:29.723 --> 17:31.584
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, well, but I'm telling my story.

17:31.804 --> 17:33.225
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, yeah, well, I mean, you're story.

17:33.265 --> 17:34.325
[SPEAKER_00]: It's also my story now.

17:34.345 --> 17:34.705
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, what?

17:36.246 --> 17:36.426
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?

17:36.926 --> 17:38.467
[SPEAKER_00]: We really wrestled with that for a time.

17:38.827 --> 17:45.114
[SPEAKER_02]: And we had a therapist that just helped us navigate, like, okay, you know, there's no black and white solutions.

17:45.154 --> 17:53.343
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, if one of you has to fully sacrifice or compromise to a point where you don't feel like you can be who you are, well, that's not good, right?

17:53.384 --> 17:57.668
[SPEAKER_02]: But the other person can't be like, oh my gosh, I have to expose myself to so much that I don't feel good.

17:58.049 --> 17:59.711
[SPEAKER_02]: So we found a middle that works for us.

18:00.331 --> 18:04.055
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's also the dance and all of these differences.

18:04.776 --> 18:11.463
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not about one person bending so much for the other and at the cost of themselves or vice versa.

18:11.523 --> 18:21.273
[SPEAKER_02]: It's about continuously being an exploration of finding ways to be collaborative and conscious of both people's needs, vulnerabilities, sensitivities.

18:21.693 --> 18:22.693
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not going to be perfect.

18:22.713 --> 18:23.753
[SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be messy.

18:24.234 --> 18:26.994
[SPEAKER_02]: Sometimes you might bend a little bit more in the other person's direction.

18:27.034 --> 18:28.654
[SPEAKER_02]: But overall, does it feel fair?

18:28.694 --> 18:34.816
[SPEAKER_02]: Is there a sense of equity and fairness as principles that are prioritizing the relationship?

18:34.916 --> 18:45.118
[SPEAKER_02]: And I want us to also talk about what are the relationship skills that are going to be vital to create in a relationship to help people tolerate

18:45.898 --> 18:48.021
[SPEAKER_02]: and makes space for these differences, right?

18:48.061 --> 18:51.484
[SPEAKER_02]: We've used a few words in this conversation already, flexibility.

18:51.504 --> 18:59.012
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's probably one of the most important things to have that cultivated collaborative mindset, right?

18:59.373 --> 19:03.257
[SPEAKER_02]: And the other one that I think about even more than anything else is willingness.

19:03.617 --> 19:04.278
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, willingness.

19:04.298 --> 19:04.959
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a big word.

19:05.299 --> 19:05.700
[SPEAKER_02]: It's you.

19:05.720 --> 19:06.801
[SPEAKER_00]: I like that word a lot.

19:07.361 --> 19:07.482
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

19:08.705 --> 19:15.370
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, in fact, when I'm working with men in my men's work, we explore that idea of willingness a lot.

19:15.650 --> 19:18.712
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like the willingness to be disappointed.

19:20.493 --> 19:22.394
[SPEAKER_00]: And the willingness to disappoint.

19:23.155 --> 19:23.555
[SPEAKER_02]: Beautiful.

19:23.895 --> 19:25.076
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow.

19:25.436 --> 19:26.237
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

19:26.337 --> 19:33.682
[SPEAKER_00]: The resistance to disappointing or being disappointed, oh, that creates so much stress in relationships.

19:35.094 --> 19:42.057
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, but the willingness to both be disappointed and be a disappointment.

19:43.278 --> 19:46.399
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, again, you and I ran it out to the very beginning, because I had all this excitement.

19:46.419 --> 19:48.100
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, let's go on this big trip.

19:48.160 --> 19:49.420
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna take you and, you know, what?

19:49.460 --> 19:52.121
[SPEAKER_00]: We're three months in and I'm like, hey, it's the holidays.

19:52.202 --> 19:52.882
[SPEAKER_00]: I got an idea.

19:53.222 --> 19:55.243
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's fly here and visit my dad and my stepmom.

19:55.263 --> 19:56.643
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's fly there and visit my sister.

19:56.683 --> 20:04.207
[SPEAKER_00]: Then let's fly there and visit my mom and Marilyn and you were just like, and you had to, I was disappointed.

20:06.178 --> 20:08.159
[SPEAKER_00]: but we both had to just be with that.

20:09.260 --> 20:12.302
[SPEAKER_02]: And it also be very sensitive about that.

20:12.742 --> 20:15.204
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not about just saying no one holding up a boundary.

20:15.744 --> 20:25.350
[SPEAKER_02]: My way or the highway, no, it's about, even if I can meet my partner's needs, I still want to be loving and caring about the fact that I can't always meet their needs.

20:25.430 --> 20:35.036
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's a really important distinction because I think boundaries and that rigidity of holding them can sometimes get taken so far that they stop being relational.

20:35.676 --> 20:36.136
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

20:36.657 --> 20:36.897
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

20:36.997 --> 20:45.943
[SPEAKER_02]: And I mean even when those are really good example of like your adventure spirits, one of the reasons I love you and we've done so many amazing adventures together.

20:46.383 --> 20:49.785
[SPEAKER_02]: But there's no way I'm ever going to be able to do as much as you.

20:49.846 --> 20:51.967
[SPEAKER_02]: That's just that's not how one wired.

20:51.987 --> 20:53.888
[SPEAKER_02]: I need a lot more rest.

20:55.329 --> 21:03.915
[SPEAKER_02]: But I remember even saying to you early on, like I wish I could clone myself so that that that other me could go be with you in these adventures and and

21:04.575 --> 21:12.979
[SPEAKER_02]: I knew that for you that was also your way of like your family coming together and witnessing you and your, you know, and these things that you loved.

21:13.119 --> 21:16.160
[SPEAKER_02]: And so I knew it was also connected to an original wound.

21:16.180 --> 21:23.083
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think that's also something really important for people to pay attention to, you know, doing the emotional work for your partner.

21:23.483 --> 21:31.187
[SPEAKER_02]: But you're witnessing them and you're supporting them when they, when they, there is disappointment present in the space as well.

21:31.527 --> 21:31.967
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

21:33.438 --> 21:38.185
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, another willingness that that a work with a lot is the willingness to be hurt.

21:39.707 --> 21:41.470
[SPEAKER_00]: The willingness to be hurt.

21:41.530 --> 21:44.575
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, if you're going to get into relationship, if you're going to do love.

21:45.351 --> 21:47.472
[SPEAKER_00]: It comes with the potential to be hurt.

21:48.813 --> 22:01.821
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, I think so much, I see so much shenanigans, so much eronically, so much hurt gets created in the unwillingness, and the resistance to being hurt.

22:02.642 --> 22:08.165
[SPEAKER_00]: And even, and I say this very carefully, the willingness to hurt your partner.

22:08.205 --> 22:14.329
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, I say that very carefully, because obviously neither you nor I are a stand for

22:14.948 --> 22:16.568
[SPEAKER_00]: people intentionally hurting their partners.

22:17.429 --> 22:25.230
[SPEAKER_00]: But again, if we're going to have honest conversations, if we're going to explore, be with the differences between us, the things that are uncomfortable.

22:25.270 --> 22:34.652
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and I think, again, there's so many examples of you and I, where you had to really be willing to hurt me.

22:35.492 --> 22:38.773
[SPEAKER_00]: And in the sense of, I think, again, when we travel, like we're going to Scotland in two weeks.

22:40.179 --> 22:40.879
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm so excited.

22:40.899 --> 22:41.900
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to have a great time.

22:42.040 --> 22:42.920
[SPEAKER_00]: And we've come a long way.

22:42.940 --> 22:43.481
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

22:44.221 --> 22:49.443
[SPEAKER_00]: But I remember when we first went on that long trip to Ireland.

22:49.523 --> 22:51.544
[SPEAKER_02]: I was dissociated for five weeks.

22:52.605 --> 22:54.706
[SPEAKER_02]: So let's go do this.

22:54.726 --> 22:55.386
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll come do this.

22:55.426 --> 22:57.687
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's drive there and do this hike in this walk.

22:57.947 --> 23:03.970
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, on some level, you had to just, you had to be willing to hurt me by saying, no, I can't.

23:04.470 --> 23:05.451
[SPEAKER_00]: You go do it without me.

23:06.051 --> 23:07.331
[SPEAKER_00]: And you're the see me be hurt.

23:08.192 --> 23:08.332
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

23:10.048 --> 23:11.869
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, you can't rescue me from that.

23:13.270 --> 23:17.071
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously, this goes both ways and relationships.

23:17.571 --> 23:19.172
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's a dance.

23:19.252 --> 23:20.332
[SPEAKER_02]: And there's wisdom there.

23:20.953 --> 23:22.653
[SPEAKER_02]: There's wisdom in your heart.

23:23.894 --> 23:28.196
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that was what allowed us to get really in touch with what was coming up for you also.

23:29.436 --> 23:41.362
[SPEAKER_02]: Because I think sometimes we also have to think about when we have such a big reaction to something, or when we're so fixated on someone showing up in a particular way, and they can't, oh, there's wisdom.

23:41.703 --> 23:43.424
[SPEAKER_02]: There's something to that.

23:44.464 --> 23:47.446
[SPEAKER_02]: I remember one of the post I wrote years ago.

23:48.546 --> 23:55.190
[SPEAKER_02]: There was a particular moment that someone made a comment to me at a wedding, and I wanted you to say something.

23:55.630 --> 23:57.051
[SPEAKER_02]: I remember I wanted you to say something.

23:57.671 --> 24:02.236
[SPEAKER_02]: And the comment itself was, you know, looking back, it was a pretty neutral comment.

24:02.296 --> 24:04.278
[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't something I really didn't do anything for.

24:04.298 --> 24:10.103
[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't any danger happening, but it activated my Coraland of not feeling protected, you know.

24:10.644 --> 24:15.569
[SPEAKER_02]: And then I remember when we processed it on that pink couch in Calabassas when the sun was setting.

24:18.131 --> 24:40.218
[SPEAKER_02]: I got really clear that, like, because as you were even like being willing and learning about that wound of mine and being on board for like, you know, recognizing how I wanted maybe things to be done differently, I just remember that dropping to my knees moment of vulnerability of just like, wow, doesn't matter what Brian actually does in these moments, it will never scratch that itch for me.

24:41.478 --> 24:51.252
[SPEAKER_02]: that feeling of not being protected is so primitive and in my root, which I think is like the mirror of your wound of neglect, right?

24:51.292 --> 24:56.199
[SPEAKER_02]: So yes, I'm not able to come on all these adventures, but there's so many adventures I was coming on.

24:56.980 --> 25:00.625
[SPEAKER_02]: So what was it about this particular thing that was so activating, right?

25:00.645 --> 25:05.352
[SPEAKER_02]: So we got to access the wound when you didn't protect me to that random moment at the wedding.

25:06.052 --> 25:07.615
[SPEAKER_02]: I got to access my wound.

25:08.015 --> 25:12.461
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's also like pulling back that layer of what's behind that curtain.

25:14.473 --> 25:33.164
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's one of the most useful relational skills is is is is getting awareness around what what what childhood wounds is your partner are you are you both bringing into this dance because they're going to be present.

25:33.637 --> 25:34.597
[SPEAKER_02]: And they're gonna collide.

25:34.677 --> 25:35.637
[SPEAKER_02]: They are.

25:35.757 --> 25:36.778
[SPEAKER_02]: They're gonna connect.

25:36.798 --> 25:38.118
[SPEAKER_00]: Like in a conspiracy almost.

25:38.178 --> 25:41.239
[SPEAKER_00]: They're really like their little conspiratorial buddies.

25:41.899 --> 25:42.519
[SPEAKER_02]: They're all demons.

25:42.639 --> 25:46.640
[SPEAKER_00]: They're like they're holding hands with mischievous looks on their faces.

25:46.720 --> 25:49.260
[SPEAKER_00]: Like how can we fuck things up in this room?

25:49.280 --> 25:49.940
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

25:50.580 --> 25:58.102
[SPEAKER_00]: And so when we're not aware of them, we're just we think we're fighting about how the dishwasher is being loaded or we're thinking we're fighting about.

25:58.622 --> 26:01.225
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, why won't you come with me to this thing, right?

26:01.586 --> 26:05.070
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not about why didn't you stand up for me when that woman said that thing?

26:05.770 --> 26:06.731
[SPEAKER_00]: We think we're fighting about that.

26:08.923 --> 26:10.784
[SPEAKER_00]: No, most of the time, it ain't about that thing.

26:10.884 --> 26:13.446
[SPEAKER_02]: Because if you had said something, I would have been embarrassed.

26:13.826 --> 26:15.227
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what's fascinating.

26:15.307 --> 26:16.548
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, right.

26:16.588 --> 26:17.288
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, thank God.

26:17.308 --> 26:20.170
[SPEAKER_02]: He didn't say anything because there wasn't really a thing to say anything to.

26:20.190 --> 26:26.173
[SPEAKER_02]: But it was a good opportunity to get access to something that really helped me look at something.

26:26.233 --> 26:28.415
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's the gift of differences.

26:28.495 --> 26:36.600
[SPEAKER_02]: I think in a relationship, too, is that they really helped point a magnifying glass towards these pieces of ourselves that

26:37.480 --> 26:40.763
[SPEAKER_02]: need a person that's different than us to bring them out.

26:41.183 --> 26:41.463
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

26:41.523 --> 27:02.019
[SPEAKER_00]: Otherwise, like if I'm just walking around the world, like when I'm single, walking around doing my thing, you know, just bouncing off a people and not really going deep and, you know, hang out a couple hours and I'm off, I don't get their reflection back as much as with, you know, when you're in a long-term relationship with someone day after day and you're like, boy, you keep these things keep showing up.

27:03.285 --> 27:12.655
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's almost like, you know, where, where you see yourself irritated or like you said, have big, big reactions to, you know, I've been, I've been studying Carl Young's work.

27:13.436 --> 27:23.727
[SPEAKER_00]: The last year doing this, this could, trying to work into bring more, you shadow work into my coaching and, and archetypes and it's such, such profound work and that's one of the things that

27:24.672 --> 27:36.582
[SPEAKER_00]: That I think is so brilliant in that depth, depth, the psychology field is, we start to really understand how the things that trigger us in the outside world are in some way.

27:36.722 --> 27:41.326
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, I say this carefully because there's a lot of things going on in the world that should fucking trigger us.

27:41.827 --> 27:42.027
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

27:42.187 --> 27:43.348
[SPEAKER_00]: That should be upsetting.

27:43.588 --> 27:44.089
[SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely.

27:44.289 --> 27:44.529
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

27:44.689 --> 27:47.412
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, that's being, that's be thoughtful about what I'm about to say here.

27:49.113 --> 28:09.077
[SPEAKER_00]: but there's the way the world triggers us points to a shadow inside of us that we have yet to that we may be in some way in denial of or it's we've repressed it or we've exiled these parts of ourselves because they weren't they weren't allowed when we were kids all kinds of things so yeah

28:09.703 --> 28:13.666
[SPEAKER_02]: And that speaks to the importance of how a witness, I think also, right?

28:13.706 --> 28:29.800
[SPEAKER_02]: Having a partner who can not fix us, but witness us as we represent that original wound in a place that's hopefully safer, more empathic, more compassionate so that we can integrate it.

28:31.020 --> 28:33.481
[SPEAKER_00]: and witness it skillfully.

28:33.861 --> 28:40.244
[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think there's a lot of couples try to witness, they say what they see, but they do it in a pretty fucked up way.

28:40.364 --> 28:42.225
[SPEAKER_02]: So let's give some practical tools.

28:42.285 --> 28:52.789
[SPEAKER_00]: How might somebody witness them in a... So one of the most valuable and simple ways is like when you notice someone having a big reaction is like, okay.

28:55.089 --> 28:57.030
[SPEAKER_00]: Deep breath, you're having a big reaction.

28:57.530 --> 28:58.930
[SPEAKER_00]: What's really going on for you?

28:59.290 --> 29:00.411
[SPEAKER_00]: What is this really about?

29:01.831 --> 29:04.551
[SPEAKER_00]: What's coming up for you in this?

29:04.711 --> 29:07.152
[SPEAKER_00]: That isn't just about me, right?

29:07.192 --> 29:11.433
[SPEAKER_00]: Because in our wound, in our reaction, we're trying to get the other person to just do something different.

29:11.493 --> 29:12.333
[SPEAKER_00]: So I don't have to feel this.

29:13.933 --> 29:21.395
[SPEAKER_00]: And not that there is no place for your partner to maybe shift some things up, maybe they're using a tone of voice that doesn't work or they're

29:22.013 --> 29:30.137
[SPEAKER_00]: It's something, not that there's no place for that, but provided they're not doing something that's actually harming you in the moment, right?

29:31.297 --> 29:35.619
[SPEAKER_00]: Getting being inquisitive, wow, what is this about for me?

29:36.319 --> 29:39.061
[SPEAKER_00]: What the hell is going on for me in this moment?

29:39.101 --> 29:41.302
[SPEAKER_00]: What is this about that?

29:41.462 --> 29:45.063
[SPEAKER_00]: You're just over there living your best life, and I have a problem with it.

29:45.243 --> 29:46.484
[SPEAKER_00]: What the hell is my problem?

29:47.204 --> 29:58.729
[SPEAKER_02]: And one of the tools I often give my clients, if it's hard to kind of access that in that moment, if you want to pull away and give yourself some time alone to be with yourself.

29:58.809 --> 30:03.051
[SPEAKER_02]: And just even thinking about, are there any memories that are coming up for you?

30:03.111 --> 30:04.032
[SPEAKER_02]: Is it just close your eyes?

30:04.072 --> 30:05.692
[SPEAKER_02]: Like what memories does this touch on?

30:07.553 --> 30:08.374
[SPEAKER_02]: or sensation.

30:08.434 --> 30:10.355
[SPEAKER_02]: Sometimes we don't have memory access.

30:10.655 --> 30:17.240
[SPEAKER_02]: Sometimes it's so early on, maybe within the first three years of our life that we don't have a like a visceral tangible memory.

30:17.280 --> 30:20.383
[SPEAKER_02]: But, oh, there's something feel I'm feeling it in my chest.

30:20.423 --> 30:21.484
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm feeling it in my belly.

30:21.564 --> 30:26.988
[SPEAKER_02]: So breathing and just being really gentle with yourself and as validating as you can be.

30:27.008 --> 30:30.951
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's that's that's often times what we need in the first time around.

30:31.351 --> 30:34.133
[SPEAKER_02]: Loving, tenderness, validation, empathy.

30:34.890 --> 30:37.132
[SPEAKER_00]: with this, uh, taking now, I'll use this saying.

30:37.233 --> 30:43.419
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know who said this first, but not him or I. So this came from somewhere else, but there's that saying you've maybe heard it.

30:43.479 --> 30:47.043
[SPEAKER_00]: So when it's when it's hysterical, it's historical.

30:47.063 --> 30:52.288
[SPEAKER_00]: Which means, again, when you're having a big reaction to something, it's historical.

30:52.448 --> 30:55.612
[SPEAKER_00]: It's rooted in something that's almost certainly not about this moment.

30:57.013 --> 31:00.134
[SPEAKER_02]: when the emotion doesn't really match the experience objectively.

31:00.414 --> 31:00.634
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

31:00.814 --> 31:01.594
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you know where that came from?

31:01.614 --> 31:02.735
[SPEAKER_00]: That's saying who said that?

31:02.815 --> 31:06.356
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know that exact saying no, but I've heard it in a lot of different ways.

31:07.016 --> 31:07.636
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

31:08.737 --> 31:08.957
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

31:09.377 --> 31:23.061
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the things that that also, one of the other tools that we both spoke about in our at our keynote to talk and also that that, you know, and I want to pause here also and say for a second.

31:23.459 --> 31:26.021
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, Sylvie, you and I were doing this podcast right now.

31:26.061 --> 31:27.421
[SPEAKER_00]: Hopefully this isn't gonna come out okay.

31:27.822 --> 31:29.423
[SPEAKER_00]: Hopefully, I hopefully this sounds good.

31:29.463 --> 31:30.323
[SPEAKER_00]: I just mean from the sound.

31:30.403 --> 31:31.644
[SPEAKER_00]: I think what we're talking about is gold.

31:32.324 --> 31:34.866
[SPEAKER_00]: Just, you know, it's a, so, but we'll get it.

31:34.886 --> 31:35.606
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll, we'll dial it in.

31:35.727 --> 31:36.107
[SPEAKER_00]: It's all good.

31:37.608 --> 31:42.110
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, we're gonna do this more, right?

31:42.150 --> 31:43.711
[SPEAKER_00]: We're stepping into an arrow.

31:43.731 --> 31:45.753
[SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully.

31:46.973 --> 31:48.254
[SPEAKER_00]: If I play my cards, right?

31:48.334 --> 31:49.455
[SPEAKER_02]: If I play my cards, right?

31:49.495 --> 31:50.516
[SPEAKER_00]: We're gonna do this more.

31:50.536 --> 31:52.757
[SPEAKER_02]: If the sound quality on this turns out okay.

31:53.415 --> 31:55.638
[SPEAKER_00]: We're coming up on ten years together.

31:56.418 --> 31:57.519
[SPEAKER_02]: September will be ten years.

31:57.539 --> 31:59.041
[SPEAKER_00]: It'll be ten years.

31:59.641 --> 32:00.082
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a big day.

32:00.162 --> 32:00.842
[SPEAKER_00]: Twenty-fifteen.

32:00.883 --> 32:02.464
[SPEAKER_00]: September thirty is twenty-fifteen.

32:03.185 --> 32:04.926
[SPEAKER_00]: The moment they are first.

32:06.294 --> 32:07.595
[SPEAKER_00]: infamous date non-date.

32:08.435 --> 32:09.115
[SPEAKER_00]: It was totally a date.

32:09.135 --> 32:12.356
[SPEAKER_00]: It says another difference, but we're not going to go that way.

32:12.416 --> 32:13.097
[SPEAKER_02]: Perception.

32:13.377 --> 32:13.997
[SPEAKER_02]: Perception.

32:15.597 --> 32:16.998
[SPEAKER_00]: Perception differences.

32:17.018 --> 32:17.098
[SPEAKER_00]: Huge.

32:17.118 --> 32:19.199
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a million differences.

32:19.239 --> 32:20.359
[SPEAKER_00]: There's so many people.

32:20.559 --> 32:33.284
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, even as you're listening to this, I would encourage you reflect on what are some of the differences that if your in relationship now or maybe it was a past relationship, what are some of the differences that you struggled with or are struggling with?

32:33.819 --> 32:40.847
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that there's differences that can still irritate us, but we still admire another person.

32:41.448 --> 32:43.090
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's an important distinction.

32:44.211 --> 32:54.623
[SPEAKER_02]: Versus a difference that you feel like is just so radically not how you want to be living your life, or maybe as such, ethically

32:55.763 --> 33:03.366
[SPEAKER_02]: colliding in a way that's just very painful or just simply, you're moving in different directions in how you want to even be in relationship, right?

33:03.386 --> 33:08.688
[SPEAKER_02]: So there is differences that do need to be addressed as well.

33:08.968 --> 33:10.508
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, a hundred percent.

33:10.588 --> 33:21.452
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's, you know, we get into the realm of, you know, needs versus desires, one of the distinctions that we do this on our, in our boundaries program.

33:21.472 --> 33:23.693
[SPEAKER_00]: We talk about requests versus requirements.

33:25.093 --> 33:33.200
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think this is actually a good segue into one of the other tools that we want to talk about is creating clear agreements.

33:35.442 --> 33:36.603
[SPEAKER_02]: Within the differences.

33:36.863 --> 33:39.305
[SPEAKER_00]: With around those differences, one of the differences, right?

33:39.345 --> 33:45.571
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, if you and I are obsessed about showing up on time together the same way, we don't need an agreement.

33:45.911 --> 33:46.952
[SPEAKER_00]: We're we're in agreement.

33:48.354 --> 33:51.255
[SPEAKER_00]: It's when, let's use this example.

33:51.736 --> 33:59.399
[SPEAKER_00]: When we first, it's funny because it's, I don't know if it's flipped over the years, but when we first worked together, I, we go out to an event.

34:00.239 --> 34:03.201
[SPEAKER_00]: I wanted to be, I wanted to stay until the end.

34:03.221 --> 34:04.501
[SPEAKER_00]: I wanted to be the last person to leave.

34:05.662 --> 34:08.103
[SPEAKER_00]: You wanted to be the first person to leave.

34:09.103 --> 34:12.805
[SPEAKER_00]: And that really, we struggle with that for the first handful of times.

34:13.365 --> 34:13.985
[SPEAKER_00]: We went out.

34:14.466 --> 34:15.306
[SPEAKER_00]: Now it's kind of flipped.

34:15.346 --> 34:19.408
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I even, right, we had that event the other night here and I went and took a nap.

34:19.468 --> 34:20.548
[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, I'm out.

34:20.568 --> 34:21.429
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't do this.

34:22.809 --> 34:28.172
[SPEAKER_02]: We've found, I don't even know if it's agreement applies to this, but we've found practical ways.

34:28.792 --> 34:29.793
[SPEAKER_02]: to navigate it.

34:30.373 --> 34:32.254
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't try to make you different than who you are.

34:32.454 --> 34:34.375
[SPEAKER_02]: And I love that you're social and interacting.

34:34.415 --> 34:36.856
[SPEAKER_02]: If anything, I'm like, you go to the networking for us.

34:37.516 --> 34:50.282
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to be home doing X, Y, and Z. And you allow, not allow, but you are supportive of the fact that I need more time to process and just to be alone and recharge.

34:51.523 --> 34:53.244
[SPEAKER_02]: And we're not in opposition of that.

34:53.304 --> 34:56.845
[SPEAKER_02]: With their space for both of us to be who we are.

34:57.686 --> 34:57.866
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

34:58.717 --> 35:03.843
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and that's the beautiful thing about clear agreements is they're honoring of both people.

35:05.265 --> 35:12.353
[SPEAKER_00]: Clear and effective agreements don't just give one person their way and the other person acquiesces.

35:13.755 --> 35:17.359
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a that's a road to resentment.

35:18.430 --> 35:23.794
[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, we say this thing, I think I might have, this might be a original quote from me.

35:23.914 --> 35:24.815
[SPEAKER_00]: From yourself.

35:24.855 --> 35:25.575
[SPEAKER_00]: From myself.

35:26.176 --> 35:27.717
[SPEAKER_00]: Disting to Brian.

35:29.178 --> 35:33.020
[SPEAKER_00]: Resentment dies in the land of clear agreements.

35:34.622 --> 35:36.183
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what agreements serve for.

35:36.223 --> 35:38.624
[SPEAKER_00]: They serve to keep things clean between us.

35:38.664 --> 35:39.365
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's also

35:40.088 --> 35:42.390
[SPEAKER_00]: I think what's great about agreements is we can renegotiate them.

35:42.870 --> 35:51.516
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, right as they we we we notice okay actually this isn't this isn't really addressing what I needed to address let's talk about it let's renegotiate let's talk about.

35:54.839 --> 35:57.941
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I think that's just such a vital tool.

35:58.867 --> 36:00.508
[SPEAKER_00]: the ability to create clear agreements.

36:00.588 --> 36:05.871
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, it's not like you just sit down for two minutes and come up in the agreement and you don't.

36:05.891 --> 36:06.651
[SPEAKER_02]: It's ongoing.

36:06.912 --> 36:07.772
[SPEAKER_00]: It is ongoing.

36:08.232 --> 36:15.897
[SPEAKER_02]: And it changes flavors and textures as you will change and are cultivating your perspectives and ways of seeing the world.

36:16.557 --> 36:22.781
[SPEAKER_02]: So the workshop I did on the Sunday of the Real Love Ready Conference, the Emblem Conference.

36:23.801 --> 36:25.843
[SPEAKER_02]: was on navigating transitions with grace.

36:26.963 --> 36:37.190
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think this is an important kind of maybe just addition to this conversation in that one of you might be going through a transition right now.

36:37.350 --> 36:42.233
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're in a relationship or an equals friend committed friendship, you might be going through a transition within yourself.

36:42.854 --> 36:46.256
[SPEAKER_02]: You might be experiencing your loved one going through a transition.

36:46.396 --> 36:48.697
[SPEAKER_02]: And that's also, are you smiling?

36:48.737 --> 36:50.498
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, nice, nice smile.

36:50.538 --> 36:51.719
[SPEAKER_02]: He's smiling in admiration.

36:52.160 --> 36:52.420
[SPEAKER_00]: Always.

36:53.020 --> 36:55.962
[SPEAKER_00]: always internally even if not extremely sweet.

36:56.742 --> 37:17.115
[SPEAKER_02]: There's, you know, transitions can be a particular moment of stress in a relationship because there isn't a clear landing pad for where that person might be or you might be going through a transition in the relationship whether it's maybe your new parents or maybe you're going from the honeymoon phase to the more committed phase of a relationship and

37:18.195 --> 37:34.313
[SPEAKER_02]: And so being just really gentle and flexible and mindful of transitions, which can be particularly just what's the word I'm looking for, just markers of even more change in difference.

37:35.174 --> 37:37.717
[SPEAKER_02]: That we may not, we might be terrified.

37:38.304 --> 37:45.730
[SPEAKER_02]: of, you know, senior partner, practice a new spirituality that is like, oh my gosh, am I going to lose connection to them?

37:45.790 --> 37:49.833
[SPEAKER_02]: How do I embrace this different way of them being in the world?

37:50.273 --> 37:51.675
[SPEAKER_02]: What do I need from them?

37:52.135 --> 37:59.200
[SPEAKER_02]: What reassurances might we start to practice so that we can stay together and connect to one another in spite of this change?

37:59.601 --> 37:59.841
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

38:00.081 --> 38:02.483
[SPEAKER_02]: So I wanted to also throw in the transition piece.

38:03.744 --> 38:06.386
[SPEAKER_00]: Look, the longer you're with someone, the more transitions you're going to go through.

38:06.732 --> 38:13.779
[SPEAKER_02]: how many freaking transitions of you and I did through individually and as a couple, oh my goodness, moves and yeah.

38:14.800 --> 38:20.726
[SPEAKER_00]: Developmentals, I feel like even in ten years, I mean just even developmental shifts, hormonal shifts.

38:20.746 --> 38:21.387
[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.

38:22.528 --> 38:29.075
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, we talk about, oh my goodness, I mean just the enormity of

38:31.368 --> 38:42.390
[SPEAKER_00]: when I don't know how well, I guess what I'm sort of marking in my own brain right now is it's just differences between two people are the norm.

38:43.251 --> 38:59.214
[SPEAKER_00]: And so much of the so-called, you know, the battle that I grew up in in era when it's like the battle of the sexes was a thing, you know, that was like a term that was used a lot, you know, and comedians were always lamenting relationship, you know,

39:00.254 --> 39:03.955
[SPEAKER_00]: They were, I was always, you know, take my wife, please, take my wife, that kind of thing.

39:04.955 --> 39:10.056
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's because we've never, no one's ever taught us how to embrace differences.

39:10.076 --> 39:11.937
[SPEAKER_00]: They've only taught us how to go to war over them.

39:12.557 --> 39:17.138
[SPEAKER_02]: Or to make them, to respect the complementary nature of them, right?

39:17.758 --> 39:18.298
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

39:18.779 --> 39:28.461
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, one of the things that I learned, and again, it's like, I don't even know if we're holding these ideas, but something that I figured out

39:30.014 --> 39:45.405
[SPEAKER_00]: That a flaw in my thinking and I think for a lot of men and a lot of women too is was I think a lot of men tended to think and still do that women are broken versions of men Right and a lot of women.

39:45.485 --> 39:49.088
[SPEAKER_00]: I think whole men as broken versions of women

39:51.045 --> 39:54.567
[SPEAKER_00]: and we're not at all broken versions of each other.

39:54.667 --> 39:55.708
[SPEAKER_00]: We're just different.

39:56.929 --> 40:01.591
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously, I'm framing that as men and women, but I'm also just two people.

40:02.232 --> 40:03.012
[SPEAKER_00]: Same sex couples.

40:03.032 --> 40:06.094
[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to have the same challenges to different people.

40:08.015 --> 40:14.239
[SPEAKER_00]: So, what do you think about this conversation so far?

40:14.951 --> 40:17.472
[SPEAKER_02]: I think we should start winding down and closing it up.

40:17.492 --> 40:18.812
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think it's that too.

40:19.172 --> 40:28.335
[SPEAKER_02]: And the piece that I want to kind of add to that, you know, the transition that I was addressing is the importance of making space for grief.

40:29.215 --> 40:30.695
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's essential, right?

40:31.356 --> 40:35.597
[SPEAKER_02]: When we're thinking about just change in other

40:36.337 --> 40:49.723
[SPEAKER_02]: Whether it's not even a change that happened, maybe it's just in your own mind, you had this expectation of a partner, you're now in a relationship and they are showing up in certain ways different than what you thought had in your fantasy, grieve the shit out of that.

40:50.224 --> 40:58.728
[SPEAKER_02]: Or if you're in a transition or they're in a transition and, you know, I wrote this quote years ago that I shared also in that workshop.

40:58.988 --> 41:03.590
[SPEAKER_02]: I grieve my expectations of you so that I may discover your love yet again.

41:04.390 --> 41:07.691
[SPEAKER_02]: It has resonated with people around the world over and over again.

41:07.711 --> 41:12.012
[SPEAKER_02]: It's because we're constantly shedding these previous versions of ourselves.

41:12.552 --> 41:22.374
[SPEAKER_02]: And for those of you listening, I imagine most of your growth-minded people that follow Brian, that follow Tate's work, and that means you're going to be growing a lot.

41:22.734 --> 41:32.877
[SPEAKER_02]: You're going to be shedding skin, and you're going to probably be in relationships with others that are shedding skin, which means that practice of being flexible with people showing up differently.

41:34.598 --> 41:40.143
[SPEAKER_02]: trying on new ways of being in the world is going to be part of your life, journey.

41:40.323 --> 41:46.569
[SPEAKER_02]: So making space for that, if you want to really go the long distance with someone.

41:46.709 --> 41:49.351
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely, get good at grieving.

41:50.172 --> 41:52.374
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so much more to say about that.

41:52.434 --> 41:53.275
[SPEAKER_00]: I wanted to pull up

41:55.319 --> 41:58.881
[SPEAKER_00]: I put a, you know, on your, you're very, very good advice.

41:59.021 --> 42:01.703
[SPEAKER_00]: I put up a little story on Instagram saying, what are y'all?

42:02.043 --> 42:07.687
[SPEAKER_00]: Silvina, we're going to start doing more podcast episodes together, just in prompt to, you know, this, just get on the mic and go.

42:07.707 --> 42:11.129
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you want us to talk about, you got a bunch of responses.

42:11.349 --> 42:11.790
[SPEAKER_02]: Amazing.

42:11.990 --> 42:14.131
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to share some of these to, to foreshadow.

42:15.772 --> 42:31.210
[SPEAKER_00]: You, my dear listener, please keep coming back because we're going to still, so if I, if I play my cards right, if play cards right, if you came to the big box for this, if I pay her, if I pay her well, we'll keep doing these conversations, but here's some good ones.

42:32.512 --> 42:35.355
[SPEAKER_00]: How to hold both passion and safety.

42:36.755 --> 42:37.435
[SPEAKER_00]: That's really good.

42:37.615 --> 42:38.816
[SPEAKER_00]: How to hold both passion and safety.

42:38.836 --> 42:42.557
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, these are, these are from the Instagram story, people responding.

42:43.357 --> 42:48.638
[SPEAKER_00]: Power struggle dynamics, communicating boundaries and conflict repair.

42:48.779 --> 42:48.939
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

42:48.959 --> 42:49.839
[SPEAKER_00]: Those are like amazing.

42:49.859 --> 42:51.079
[SPEAKER_00]: The one on one is the basics.

42:51.459 --> 42:51.679
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.

42:51.799 --> 42:51.999
[SPEAKER_00]: Good.

42:52.480 --> 42:56.821
[SPEAKER_00]: The various phases of relationships and transitions each partner may go through.

42:57.201 --> 42:58.941
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, he just touched on that.

42:58.961 --> 42:59.122
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

42:59.502 --> 43:00.502
[SPEAKER_00]: Experiencing loss.

43:00.842 --> 43:01.322
[SPEAKER_02]: together.

43:01.342 --> 43:01.882
[SPEAKER_02]: Yep.

43:02.903 --> 43:03.163
[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

43:03.663 --> 43:04.764
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's see.

43:05.704 --> 43:06.664
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a really big one.

43:07.425 --> 43:08.365
[SPEAKER_02]: That's a really big one.

43:08.625 --> 43:16.708
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, a lot of relationship phases moving in with each other transitions again going deeper and they've been using work transitioning to marriage life.

43:16.788 --> 43:19.549
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so that theme of transitions is coming up a lot.

43:19.729 --> 43:24.131
[SPEAKER_00]: How to hold space during wounded shares or shares about upset.

43:26.148 --> 43:27.149
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's really good.

43:28.310 --> 43:33.737
[SPEAKER_00]: When your partner or dating three months says your needs are your responsibility.

43:34.257 --> 43:34.698
[SPEAKER_00]: We'll change.

43:35.619 --> 43:36.920
[SPEAKER_00]: We should do a Q&A series.

43:37.080 --> 43:42.687
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, we could even do some, well, we could even do some actual little Instagram videos of we're addressing some of these.

43:44.798 --> 43:46.679
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, there's a lot more work.

43:46.699 --> 43:55.202
[SPEAKER_00]: So we got a lot of juicy stuff and even this subject, we're gonna keep revisiting it because I think it's just such a vital embracing differences for deeper connection.

43:55.262 --> 44:00.504
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's gold because that's life on human, on planet Earth.

44:01.325 --> 44:07.087
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, one of the things I love about this work, Sylvia, is also like when men, especially gamma man.

44:07.127 --> 44:09.788
[SPEAKER_00]: So I tend to speak, you know, from a man's perspective.

44:11.649 --> 44:15.073
[SPEAKER_00]: as men learn how to do relationship well in an intimate relationship.

44:16.034 --> 44:20.319
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think we become better leaders in every other domain.

44:20.800 --> 44:22.161
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, we become better.

44:22.181 --> 44:23.383
[SPEAKER_02]: So you're seeing a major better?

44:25.300 --> 44:26.080
[SPEAKER_00]: without a doubt.

44:27.161 --> 44:29.161
[SPEAKER_00]: You make me a better man.

44:29.661 --> 44:31.502
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I've never been this spicy on a podcast.

44:31.582 --> 44:32.982
[SPEAKER_02]: I just, you have to bear your life.

44:33.042 --> 44:34.162
[SPEAKER_02]: You have to bear with me.

44:34.182 --> 44:38.403
[SPEAKER_02]: It took Brian six months to get the unmasked version of me.

44:38.783 --> 44:40.924
[SPEAKER_00]: So you guys are getting it after ten years.

44:41.064 --> 44:43.985
[SPEAKER_02]: No, you're getting it after a three podcast guest episode.

44:44.025 --> 44:45.025
[SPEAKER_00]: I like this.

44:45.305 --> 44:47.266
[SPEAKER_00]: This is enjoyable to make this fun.

44:47.646 --> 44:50.026
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm in, I'm in, I'm in totally into it.

44:50.646 --> 44:52.247
[SPEAKER_00]: So, well, thank you.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: My love for joining me in this episode of Bridging Connections podcast.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you to my dear listeners for showing up and and keep going back and we appreciate you guys and and and look forward to even we're having some more in person events coming soon.

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[SPEAKER_02]: So stay tuned for that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've got more in person events coming soon.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm

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[SPEAKER_00]: I am coming into my enrollment period for elevate twenty twenty six, which is my I've been doing this will be my six year of bringing men through a year long just an extraordinary year long adventure into the five pillars of a thriving man and how to elevate our lives and that's coming up feel free to reach out to me about that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: What do you want to tell people about?

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[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, oh, gosh, with this conference, he's just bringing up so many like other things of disclaimers that I'm like, oh, I want to address this, but we'll have to do a part two three four five six seven.

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[SPEAKER_02]: If you are somebody that is in your dating journey and you want

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[SPEAKER_02]: that in-depth support to really clarify what your relationship vision is, what your values are, so that you can be really intentional about your process.

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[SPEAKER_02]: You can reach out to me and we can set up a free consultation.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wonderful.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I will put your website.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Silicucacin.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Easy to spell.

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[SPEAKER_02]: Easy, so easy.

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[SPEAKER_02]: You can just type it in right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Just type it in right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I bet.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I love you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Good job.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Happy on my anniversary, honey.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Happy on my anniversary.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Bye.